Arlene Is Alone with Kardinal Offishall

Kardinal Offishall, Canadian hip-hop icon and multi-platinum artist, joins Arlene for a deeply personal conversation about the Black experience growing up in Canada, the lessons his mother taught him about navigating the world, and how he's now teaching his own sons. Kardinal opens up about why doing the inner healing work is essential, not optional, and how confronting your own pain transforms every relationship you have. Plus, an unforgettable vasectomy story. This is a conversation about legacy, growth, and what it means to be Black in a world that's still learning.

Transcript

SPEAKER_01 0:04

The doctor says, Hey, listen, I'll be back in like five minutes. I'm like, cool, whatever. So I'm laying there on the table, naked from the waist down. Nurse comes in and says, Do you remember me? I was like, oh my God. I said, uh, no. She's like, yeah, we were in, we were in your friend Troy's wedding party together. I was like, oh, good to see you.

SPEAKER_04 0:34

Hi everyone, it's Arlene Dickinson.

SPEAKER_00 0:37

Welcome to this week's episode of Arlene is alone. Cardinal official is a Canadian hip hop icon, a multi-platinum artist, producer, and the creative force behind some of this country's most defining tracks. But beyond the music, beyond the accolades, Cardinal is a son who learned how to navigate the world from a mother who prepared him for realities he shouldn't have had to face. He's a father teaching his own sons those same lessons while trying to build a different world for them. In this conversation, Arlene and Cardinal go deep. Talking about the black experience growing up in Canada, the lessons his mother taught him about survival and dignity, and how he's passing that wisdom to his sons. They also talk about something Cardinal is passionate about but rarely discussed. How doing the inner work of the uncomfortable, honest healing transforms not just you, but every relationship you have. Plus, an unforgettable vasectomy story that you absolutely have to hear. This is Cardinal Official. Raw, reflective, and real.

SPEAKER_04 1:48

Hey everyone, welcome back to Arlene's Alone. But today I am alone with my good friend Cardinal Official.

SPEAKER_01 1:54

Ah, yes! Alone with Cardinal. That's what my wife says.

SPEAKER_04 2:01

Is that an ongoing complaint that she is alone with you?

SPEAKER_01 2:04

Oh my goodness. Well, it it depends on what night in our bedroom, but yes. 20 plus years of being alone with Jason, that's what she would say.

SPEAKER_04 2:14

Is that is that your real name, Jason?

SPEAKER_01 2:16

It is, but uh rest in peace. The only person that really used to call me that is my grandmother that recently passed away.

SPEAKER_05 2:23

Oh, I'm sorry.

SPEAKER_01 2:23

So yeah, she well, I mean, listen, 97 beautiful years of life. Wow. Yeah, yeah, yeah. She was very, she was very strong. And I was gonna say, up until the last couple of years, like she was one of those people in her 90s gardening and cooking and church and doing all the things. So um, bittersweet. Yeah, bittersweet, bittersweet. I have a lot of characters in my family. Okay, a lot of a lot we balance the grief with the joy, you know what I'm saying? We always try and find a way to um see the beauty and see the humor in most of what we do. And I think for me, it's way important because the entertainment industry is um the worst, but it's a lot of, you know, it's a lot of fun if you can somehow build up um a force field of great energy around you.

SPEAKER_04 3:18

I've heard that from a lot of my friends who are musicians, that it's a very difficult or entertainers in general. I mean, I I I know from the television world it can be, it can be, it's it's so not what everybody thinks it is, right? That there's just so much pressure and there's so much um backstabbing and so much kind of it it's it's it can be very, really difficult. But is it worse in the musical?

SPEAKER_01 3:39

Well, you know, you know what's interesting is that TV was kind of a relief for me. Like it's uh that's interesting. It is pressure, but in a in a different way, like in a in a way that was exciting to me. Because music, um, a lot of times at this point in time, in a great way, can be for me muscle memory.

SPEAKER_05 3:58

Right.

SPEAKER_01 3:58

Like there's not the challenge, is is when you're in studio creating, but even that is fun. But all the other stuff is kind of plug and play at this point. Whereas TV for me, like I loved having Howie mentor me, like, you know, I'm saying the first day in and first season and second season, be able to sit with like a vet like him and be able to say, no, Cardi, like you're killing it. Like, we need your energy, we need your vibe on screen, you know what I'm saying? And not one of those ones where he's just like gassing me to like make me feel better, you know what I mean? Because how he's also people don't know behind the scenes, he'll tell you, he'll be like, that was trash. Yeah, you know, but having relationships like that are so important for me because it helps me to navigate unfamiliar territory. And I think for me, on the music side, you can rely heavily upon if you're with a live band, like you know what I mean. That's four or five personalities that are working together with you to create this experience. Even if it's a scale-down thing, you still might have a backup vocalist and a DJ. You know what I'm saying? But when it comes to TV, it's it's really just what you can bring. And I think that's why it's so important for me to um to really be thankful to have had those conversations and those experiences that I did um with Howie because it was super valuable to me. And in a place where, had it been a different circumstance, it would have been all that back biting and backstabbing and and all that crazy stuff that I hear about. But I'm super thankful that my experience in TV um so far has been incredible.

SPEAKER_04 5:43

Well, I mean, you you make you make me pause because I think that what you just said, when I think about my experience, you know, over 20 years of being on television, I feel I have had the same kind of relationship with people who actually care about whether you're gonna, you know, they want you to look good. They don't want to make you look bad. They want you, especially when you're on a cast like you're on, and same with the Dragon's Den, you know, you're not on there to have somebody make you look bad. So you need mentorship, you need people who want to have a relationship with you, you know, in on and off screen. But I I gotta tell you, Carnell, like you are, you have, I'm not gonna call you Jason, but I really want. I really I really want I want to be like, okay, Jason.

SPEAKER_01 6:25

Whatever you feel comfortable with. I'm gonna call it whatever you feel comfortable with.

SPEAKER_04 6:28

But no, when I think about um you have you have that thing. And and and I'm sure.

SPEAKER_01 6:35

I went to the doctor to try and clear that up.

SPEAKER_04 6:37

And is the medication helping at all? Clearly not. Clearly, not helping. Like, I mean, there's hope. There's there's research going on. I'm sure we can figure that out one day what's going on with you. Um, but but for for you, like you've got this. You first of all, you have a charisma. The first time I met you, you had the white, you had the white, I had the white streak, you had the white streak. Remember?

SPEAKER_01 6:59

The Raptors game. That's right. That's when we're courtside. Yes, I do remember. I do remember. That's right.

SPEAKER_04 7:05

I I was so struck by your charisma. You have, I mean, uh, listen, a lot of you have to have charisma to be a good artist. I think you have to have stage presence. Uh, sure, you have to have good music. Absolutely. But you have it, you have it, um, a lot of people don't have it in person too. They turn it on when the screen is on. But you have it, like you genuinely have this, like you if you're you're effusive, you have the big laugh, you have a you know, like a good presence. Like, honestly, um, are you are you starting to get your is your head getting big?

SPEAKER_01 7:38

No, no, no, no, no, not at all. More, more.

SPEAKER_03 7:40

Not just you know what?

SPEAKER_01 7:44

I'll tell let me let me um sorry to cut you up. Let me give you an example or where I think that that came from, yeah, or at least when I knew it was a superpower. So Mr. Morgan's currently the president of uh Drake's record label of OVO. We used to all work together, and I remember we used to go into these meetings back in the day, and Mr. Morgan, he would just say, All right, we're about to go into this meeting and meet such and such. Make sure you do the Cardi thing. And I was like, I don't know what you're talking about. He's like, Don't worry about it. And we'd go into the meeting, and I'm like, Just being you, just being myself, and we come out, he'd be like, Amazing, you killed it. I was like, All right. And I think at the end of the day, what it is is I I learned from a professionally, I learned from a younger age that whatever this is, and I try and mentor, you know, younger artists, younger execs, whatever, is that this thing that I have, I know nobody else has it. And I've always been taught, and I try to teach others that like if there's a plate of food that somebody has and it's like, you know, it's it's it's full of food, uh, they don't need what you have. They're like, no, no, I'm I'm good. You know what I'm saying? Like I have all the things. So stop, you know, don't try and add to their already full plate. You gotta see what they do not have. You know what I'm saying? And if we parallel that to energy or vibes or whatever you can contribute, I think for me, I know when I walk into the room, it's one of those ones where I'm gonna be myself. I'm going to be loud, I'm gonna be boisterous, um, I'm gonna be energetic. And, you know, 80% of the of the people I think enjoy it. There are 20% of the people that I feel are kind of insecure, you know, that intimidated by it. That are intimidated by it. But, you know, the funny thing is it's like I'm one of the least, or I think I am one of the least most intimidating people in a room, unless I have to be. So unless there is something where I'm like, listen, Arlene, we're going to war. When we go in there, we got a mission and we got to let them know. And we go and we do our thing, that's that's something different. But most of the time, I am in a place to have the most fun that I can every single day. Every single day, because especially this year, this year's been rough, rough, rough. A lot of deaths, a lot of people passing away. But I think what I've been taking from that is to even more enjoy every opportunity that I have. The other thing is it's like, listen, I'm turning 50 in just under a year. And it's like there are so many people that I started with that are not doing the things that they love in life and able to pay their mortgage, able to support their family, and able to bring them, you know I mean, some kind of joy and and and really just like live out their passion and their purpose every day. So it's like for me, that's why I'm I am this way. Yeah, you know, because I think any other way is me not living in gratitude. Yeah, there's some family relationships that I had that were the worst, like never talking to that person ever again in life. Like, I mean, ever. I'm fine. Yeah, but over the years, therapy and mentorship have also helped. Because once you have those tools, then you also realize I'm like, oh, that person actually just needed a hug.

SPEAKER_05 11:18

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 11:19

That person just actually needed me to uh, you know, pick up.

SPEAKER_02 11:23

Meet them where they were. Sorry to interrupt.

SPEAKER_01 11:26

Not necessarily. No, okay. No, some like what it is is that sometimes people don't realize that it's misdirected energy that they have. Some people are not happy with themselves and they start to have this outward thing to where it's like instead of working on what's happening really inside their body, mind, spirit, so physically, emotionally, spiritually, all that stuff, they start to lash out. And I think what it is is that when you when you start to work on yourself, you do the shadow work, you do this, you do that, and you start to have those tools, you start to see it in other people. And sometimes I didn't love it at first, but sometimes in layman's terms, you have to be the bigger person. Yeah, and you know, I'll leave their name out of it, but the thing is, we have a fantastic relationship right now. I remember there was a family member, and we hadn't seen eye to eye in years, years. And at the time, I think I was justified in terms of being able to say, hey, listen, boundaries, I'm not interested in communicating with that person. But I remember I called her at like I don't know, maybe 7 a.m. in the morning and she was sleeping. And remember, we're not on good terms at all. And I said, listen, I love you, and I'm not really sure of where this came from, like what happened, but I said, you know, I love you, and I really want for us to be able to, whatever that mess was, to put it behind us and move forward and to really build something awesome because I would prefer that that's what the rest of our lives look like moving forward. And I remember there wasn't an argument, there wasn't a comment. She was like, I would like that. And from then we've been good. But here's the thing: had I not taken that step to say, and this is listen, this is my arch enemy. Yeah, but something in me said, you know what? I'm I'm gonna call and I'm gonna do this thing. The funny thing is, the more we do the work on ourselves, the more it actually benefits everybody that's in our lives.

SPEAKER_04 13:50

I find that like I think that's I think that's uh deeply true. I I think you have to, in order to have the courage to pick up that phone to call her, you have to be confident and able to say to yourself, if she said if she rejects me, I'm okay.

SPEAKER_06 14:06

That's right.

SPEAKER_04 14:07

If she says, great, I'm okay. That's right. Either way, I've done everything I can do. And that's hard. It is hard to pick up that phone now.

SPEAKER_01 14:14

Hard listen, I'm a Taurus born May 11th. I always tell people, like, being a Taurus, it's it's strength of the bull.

SPEAKER_05 14:22

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 14:22

But if you know a bull, it is also that we are the most stubborn folks out there.

SPEAKER_05 14:29

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 14:29

So for somebody like me to like, you know, come all that way and and and be able to, you know, get to this point where I really do feel like, you know, I have you ever you ever see on construction sites those guys with the tool belts and they got like 50 keys over here and they're able to do all the things like that's what I feel like in terms of like emotional intelligence and being able to really express myself the way that I would like to, and also not taking everything personal.

SPEAKER_04 14:59

Yeah, it's hard. It is it that comes with age too, I think. I think as you get older and you start to realize that things aren't fatal when you know somebody says something or thinks something or does something, and you start to become more in tune with what makes you happy. I think I think age helps, don't you think?

SPEAKER_01 15:17

Well, let me let me add this layer to our lasagna here. Um culturally, Caribbean people are old school, they are stubborn, they are stuck in their ways. And the things that my like my generation, me and my cousins all the time, we are so thankful. We are breaking the cycle. There's a lot of elders that I have that passed away up until just last weekend, a few days before I came here to talk to you. They die with trauma. They die with Yeah, they hold on to it. They hold on to the trauma, they hold on to the triggers, they're not interested in changing their ways. And I think for my generation right now, sometimes it's extremely difficult because we are hyper-aware of what's happening, and we actually try and um introduce some of our learnings to the older generation. They're just it's it's just something that they're not okay with. And I think um, you know, Jamaicans especially, pride is a big thing. Shame is a big thing. We we laugh. Like one of the biggest, like one of the biggest things that fuel us growing up was to not shame anybody in our family. Like that's a that's a big thing. Big oh man. Oh, listen, no bada shiam we're like you can't go. Listen, you see these socks? Yep. Brand new socks. There's a reason because heaven forbid you have to go in an ambulance, do not have socks with a hole in it. So you have brand new underwear, brand new underwear, do not go to the hospital and you're there in some tattered old, you know, your favorite pair of underwear. Like, no, like listen, our house, the houses are clean because yeah, they should be clean, but also don't shame me if somebody comes to the front door and the whole house is nutty. Like, that's just you know, it's it's a it's a part of the culture. So I think here's uh interesting conversation that I that I'd like to have people kind of understand. Like when I walk outside, I can't you can't hide this. You know what I mean? You can't put it away, and that's not to lessen anybody's experience, but sometimes when it comes to uh what your religious beliefs are, there are ways that even if you don't want to, you can't hide it if you so choose. You know, if you feel that wearing a specific item or garb is going to have you facing persecution, obviously there's gonna be this pull between, you know, I should be able to do whatever, but worst worst case scenario, you can hide it. You know, you can't tell somebody's religion based on how they look. But, you know, the thing is like I walk into the room all the time and like, yeah, sure, I have a wife and three kids, but if you didn't know that, you wouldn't know what my sexual preference is. And that's the thing, is it's like I can, I still have that choice of letting you know or not.

SPEAKER_06 18:37

Right.

SPEAKER_01 18:37

You know, I was watching the Luther Van Dross documentary, and doesn't matter if I think he was gay or not, he literally said, I'm never going to say it out loud because it's my business. It's a great documentary, fantastic documentary. And I think what it is is that people don't understand what it's like to be not just black, like there's there's different versions of it to be black, to be Asian, um, to be, you know, whatever it is, Middle Eastern. Um you walk outside, and I'm not saying that we walk outside and it's gloom and doom.

SPEAKER_06 19:16

No.

SPEAKER_01 19:16

But what I'm saying is that, like, especially for me, being a six foot four, black guy, you know, noisy chains, whatever the scenario is, um, the reality is that my mom had to have the talk with me when I was younger to say, listen, because of so many factors, because of what people see on TV, movies, the news, rumors, whatever it is, or even some people bringing what they think they know of people from other places, whatever it is, what your grandparents' experience was past down. There's so many different factors as to why people are going to be, they're going to be judged. Something that I don't think that you or a lot of your relatives would ever have to worry about is like uh what happened to like a Trayvon Martin. Oh, yes, you know, yes, having a hoodie on, yeah, doing whatever.

SPEAKER_05 20:21

Yeah, doing nothing.

SPEAKER_01 20:22

It's like, listen, with my boys, my boys are fantastic. They go to private schools, straight A's, whatever. You know, thank God we are doing well, so they've never been hungry. But if we go into a store, guys, hands out of your pocket, take your hoodie off.

SPEAKER_05 20:38

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 20:39

Not because they're bad kids at all, but because that's the way society is.

SPEAKER_04 20:43

It's it's it's so ridiculously wrong.

SPEAKER_01 20:47

I know.

SPEAKER_04 20:48

It's it's it's that's why I asked about having the weight of it because I honestly I I I struggle to imagine it because you know, I can say I've I've experienced prejudice as a female. Sure, I can talk about that all day long. And so, you know, I've been the only one. That is nothing compared to what you just expressed. Like I'm, you know, I sometimes, yes, you could be afraid to walk out on the street because there are, you know, sexual predators out there. There are people that would, you know, you know, abuse and and and take advantage of you. So certainly there are challenges um that are gender related. But I think about the trans community right now, I think about what they're going through. But I in particular, because I maybe because I'm South African and I have, you know, I I I I feel like it was it's my I was raised to just everybody is equal. I I honestly was I was probably the you know unusual white family in South Africa that was raised to believe that everybody was equal. But my dad, like he he like he he he insisted that we think about people as people. He said you do never you never see somebody's color or religion or race, like you never see that first. You see the person. And I I can honestly tell you, and and so I I I I struggle with I look at what's going on in the states with. Ice like what the actual hell like talking about being afraid of walking out your door. And it's it is, it's it's targeting, you know, the the Hispanics, the blacks, the Latinos, the you know, the Asians. It's it's the the the immigrants who really aren't immigrants, they're newcomers to the country. You know, like it's it's just all yeah, it's it's so you know what's interesting.

SPEAKER_01 22:22

There's so there's so many levels to that, and it's it's very like I performed for Nelson Mandela when I was a kid. Like when he came here, I think he did uh two appearances, and one of them, uh, the group that I was in at the time, uh the the first name of the group was called Young Black Panthers, and they're like, it might be a little bit maybe maybe on the edge.

unknown 22:47

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 22:48

They're like, you guys are 13. I don't know if we're so we changed it to Young Black Impositive.

SPEAKER_06 22:53

Okay.

SPEAKER_01 22:54

Um, but we were chosen, we won a contest, and we were able to perform for Nelson, and he was still with Winnie at the time. Wow. And, you know, I've uh shout out to Nando's. I was able to visit South Africa for the first time um with Nando's some years back, and even that was a very interesting experience I found for myself. Because I found myself in again, like there's classism, there's so many layers. Like I found myself, you know, we're traveling first class and yada, yada, yada. But I thought I thought it was so interesting being in places in South Africa where the white South Africans looked at me like, what are you doing here? That was uh screwed my mind up because I was like, oh yeah, oh yes.

SPEAKER_04 23:40

Isn't it what are they doing?

SPEAKER_01 23:41

Well, this is the thing that I didn't understand. Because, you know, when you when you go to the continent, you know, the same way, like, listen, when I go to Europe, I'm like, yeah, sure, now Europe looks very different. But traditionally or historically, when you think about Europe, European folks look a certain way.

SPEAKER_05 24:00

Right.

SPEAKER_01 24:00

When you think about the continent of Africa, you're like, you know who are the major inhabitants of that place. So again, this just goes back to some of the stuff that we are talking about. Even though it is South Africa and it's within the continent, because I am somebody who has worked very hard and able to travel a certain way or be in certain rooms, there's people that would make you think that you don't belong in those rooms. And I think for South Africa, it meant a lot to me. Because growing up, even over here, I remember, you know, people singing and speaking out about apartheid and Sun City. And when we're talking about, you know, present-day North America, and it's like it, I don't, it's so weird. Like it feels like we're going back to the 60s. Like it's it is absolutely I was in Chicago when they, I think either the first or second weekend of that whole ice mess in Chicago. And like the reality is I had to be just very aware, yeah, knowing that, you know, I had my passport on me at all times, but I don't even know if that would have mattered per se. Yeah. Like the same way that as a man, I will never know what it's like. And you know, my mom has told me several times that like she raised us my myself and my sister differently. She had to have specific talks that were applied or applicable, sorry, for my sister and for women. And things that I was not aware of as a man, she's like, Yeah, you'd never know what it's like to be in certain situations, and you can't go in another room that's not with a lot of people. Right. You can't walk down that dark alley. You can't do there's all these different things that I wasn't aware of until I educated myself or until somebody told me about it. And I think in many ways, that's very similar. That like that black experience is the same. Shout out to my to my good friend Ozzie about the management's changed since then, but you know, I had um a management team where, you know, South Asian, white, whatever, mix of people. But we'd have a similar conversation like this, and you'd say it, and then it's it's it's much different when when Ozzy like saw it play out in real life, and she's like, oh my God. And like her face would go absolutely red, and she and she'd be almost apologetic. And I'm like, it's what my world is. Yeah, you know, and it's one of those ones where it's like, you know, you can go, you can be just anybody out here, anybody in society, you could literally go your entire life and never be up close and personal with it, depending on what your friends and family circle is.

SPEAKER_04 26:57

Yeah, you know, yeah. I mean, well, listen, I think these types of conversations are increasingly important because we are going backwards in so many ways. Feels like that. And if we don't talk about it and and have it be clear and obvious to people, people will they they it will get it will get, you know, like the whole DEI initiatives getting kind of swept away, the whole idea of diversity being you know unimportant or you know, like and because every you know it's all about meritocracy. Well, yeah, it's about meritocracy and it's about equal opportunity for anybody, you know, whether no matter who you are, right? So I I I I love that you I mean, thanks for sharing that because I think it's really an important conversation. I think we could talk about that for quite some time. Um, but I put a bow on it.

SPEAKER_01 27:45

That's something that I think that your viewers would really love, or I I would hope that they would love. Yeah. Is some there's you know, people say, and it it, you know, we don't even think about it sometimes. People say, I don't see color. But I always encourage people to see color.

SPEAKER_02 28:01

To see color.

SPEAKER_01 28:02

I want you to see our differences, but our differences are not supposed to drive us apart.

SPEAKER_06 28:08

Right.

SPEAKER_01 28:09

I'm like, I did. Here's the thing we've known each other for years, but either I forgot or I did, or I never knew that you came from South Africa. To me, I think that's interesting because it's like I want to learn about what it was like. I want to learn about things that you did, and I think it should be vice versa. Once we are, I think bigotry, prejudice, racism, sexism, classism, a lot of these things are because of ignorance and a lack of education. And I think the more that we do have these conversations and we do see color, we do see beliefs, we do see all these different things, and we actually learn and say, I never knew that. That's incredible.

SPEAKER_04 28:51

And and that's that's that asking the question, having the conversation, and not shying away from, you know, because I think people don't ask because they don't want to say the wrong thing. You don't want to ask the wrong way, you don't want to say something you shouldn't. But we should have another conversation. One day I'll tell you about my trip to South Africa where my white relatives took me to Sun City, and I'll tell you all about that because that is a whole other conversation about, you know, I it I can't even what it did to me in terms of how it framed my understanding of you know white and black South Africans was was very profound.

SPEAKER_06 29:24

Wow.

SPEAKER_04 29:24

So we'll talk about that at some point. But I want to, I wanna, you've got so much going on right now, Cardinal. You've got like you've got a new EP coming out. Yes. What's it called?

SPEAKER_01 29:33

Everyday sometimes.

SPEAKER_04 29:34

Everyday sometimes. But what and and what's the what's the song about?

SPEAKER_01 29:39

Uh well, what it is is it's like, you know, if you call me and they're like, Cardi, you've been in the gym? Yeah, every day sometimes.

SPEAKER_03 29:48

I'm gonna use it. It's kind of you know what?

SPEAKER_01 29:51

It's kind of like alone with our leader. It's the same kind of thing.

SPEAKER_03 29:54

I love that every day sometimes.

SPEAKER_01 29:56

That's right. Oh man, we've been sticking to your diet every day sometimes. So I think um, you know, that's great. As we spoke about earlier, I like to have fun. But the other thing is that um musically, I'm not always in the same mood. So it's like there's some days when I'm super hyper and I create super hyper energetic music that you want to work out to, but then there are some days when it's like I might be inspired by Bob Marley to want to do a reggae song today.

SPEAKER_02 30:29

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 30:29

So it's like, yo, you're you know, you're doing a creativity into reggae, yeah, every day sometimes. You know, and that's really what that whole that's what that's that's what that whole project is about.

SPEAKER_04 30:38

Get his new album when it's out, or it's EP. They don't say album anymore, do they? They say EP.

SPEAKER_01 30:43

You know what? It really, it really, it really depends. It's all a bunch of whatever. At this point in time, like whenever the music is out there, we're just happy if you stream it.

SPEAKER_04 30:52

Stream the stream the songs. Okay, you don't you're doing that. You actually, and I've been like looking at you because I mean, first of all, you're very handsome. Um, but look at the glasses.

SPEAKER_01 31:01

Hold on a second. I just want to look at the camera so my wife can hear that, Jason.

SPEAKER_04 31:10

Jason? Yes, I can't see you as Jason. I'm I want to be like your mom calling Jason. You need to get to your room right now.

SPEAKER_01 31:18

Um the glasses.

SPEAKER_04 31:21

Everybody look at the glasses. Oh, yes. Tell us about your glass line.

SPEAKER_01 31:24

Yes, so uh shout out to my good friend um Odin Coppella. This is a um these glasses, there are actually four different silhouettes. Um, this is one of four.

SPEAKER_02 31:36

Can I see them?

SPEAKER_01 31:37

Of course you can. Hold on a second. I told you about shame. I just have to make sure they're not filthy.

SPEAKER_04 31:42

Make sure they're clean.

SPEAKER_01 31:43

Listen, I don't need for anybody to yell at me, yeah. Make sure I'm clean your glasses before you give Miss Arlene. Oh, you could give her the dotted glasses. There you go.

SPEAKER_04 31:53

Okay. All right. What do you think? Are they me? Oh yeah, what do you guys think? Yeah? Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 32:00

Now here's the tagline. They look good on everybody.

SPEAKER_04 32:04

There you go. So, new glass line. Where can people buy those?

SPEAKER_01 32:08

You know, if you know me, I'll be very vocal. So just follow me at Cardinalo, you know, all the stuff, Instagram, X, YouTube, and when it comes, you'll you'll see it. But yeah, this is do out. Do out in uh spring of 2026.

SPEAKER_04 32:23

Oh, very cool. They're really, they're very, they're very nice. I really I'm a very picky sunglass person. And then the and you also got a barber shop, which actually doesn't surprise me. The barber shop does not surprise me. Because can you see, can you see his hair right now?

SPEAKER_01 32:36

And this, to be honest, I need a I need a redy and uh a little fixable.

SPEAKER_04 32:40

Is it a it's like a is like is it a leaf? So it's a crown, yes.

SPEAKER_01 32:44

It's a crown, but because I'm 6'4, most people can't see on top of my head unless I'm sitting down. But yes, so shout out to my partner Moots. Uh uh Moots is one of my favorite barbers in the world, and uh I think actually nobody loves hair more than him. Um, but I've always, you know, while I still have it, my hairline is still intact. I still do crazy stuff. So I always tell people as long as I have hair, I'm just going to do all the wackiest things. And anyways, we built upstairs chairs. It is beautiful, it's an awesome spot. And um, you know, besides going to get the most amazing haircuts there, we're also gonna do some cool initiatives to where, like we're gonna do first Sundays to where on the Sunday, first Sunday of every month, we're gonna offer up free haircuts to people from um underserved communities, things like that. So we really want to make it a place where yes, people get their haircut, but also where people come there and they leave um feeling better about themselves, but also knowing that they're contributing to a place that is gonna contribute back into the community as well.

SPEAKER_04 33:51

I love that. I mean, do you do you do the whole like hot towel and steam and like the shaving cream and the are you is that part of it, or is it more just so let me tell you something.

SPEAKER_01 34:02

Um I do do it, but the thing is that nobody wants it from me. So not you.

SPEAKER_04 34:07

I meant I meant does the barber shop do that? I don't I wouldn't I don't think I'd want you with a straight razor.

SPEAKER_01 34:12

This is the thing. I approach people with the hot towel and the razor, and they say no. People ran out of the chair, they refused me. I don't know what it is about me, why they don't want to receive it from me, but um yeah.

SPEAKER_04 34:24

Um I maybe that's what we we actually had that in common because I I have done late, like I think I've done everything with my hair too. I've been red, I've been blonde, I've been gray, I've had curly hair, I've had straight hair. I don't know. I kind of like it all. Like I like I've had long, short, I I think hair is it's one of those things that it bec if it becomes how you I you know, if you identify with it's gotta be a certain way all the time, then I think it's restrictive. So I I I like you know it being a creative part of me. I'm sure there are people who will tell me it looks better when it's short or it looks better when it's curly or whatever. I actually just do it for me, and when I get bored, I say, oh, let's try this now. That is absolutely me. Yeah, yeah, I'm the same way.

SPEAKER_01 35:02

Hence the random crown.

SPEAKER_04 35:03

It's probably the only thing we have in common. I mean, you're you're way cooler than I am. Like, let's not kid ourselves. There's cool, there's Carnell, and then there's Arlene.

SPEAKER_01 35:14

First and foremost, I don't know if this tracksuit comes in a in a 2X, but I but listen, that is a very cool track suit.

SPEAKER_04 35:22

Thank you. I'm thank you, thank you.

SPEAKER_01 35:23

I, you know, um when you grow up in the neighborhood and you have something that is really dope, people will say, hey, what size is that?

SPEAKER_04 35:30

Because they want to take it from you.

SPEAKER_01 35:31

That's right. But you know, with you, I didn't have to ask because I'm like, well, it's not gonna fit me. So don't.

SPEAKER_04 35:38

All right. Um you know, one of the things we haven't talked about is, and I just want to, you know, we don't want to spend a lot of time, but as much time as you want to spend. How'd you meet your wife?

SPEAKER_01 35:48

Oh man. Um I met my wife through that same family member that I couldn't stand.

SPEAKER_04 35:55

Oh so you owed her one.

SPEAKER_01 35:59

Yes, yes, yes. She is she is in a lot of ways responsible for the life that I have right now. So um how many years ago was that? Might have been early 2001. Only reason I say that is because when 9-11 happened, she was supposed to be on a she was in uh she went to Howard University at the time. She was supposed to be on a class excursion to the Pentagon.

SPEAKER_05 36:24

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 36:24

So when the Pentagon was hit, I spent the whole day trying to get a hold of her because you know, but at the at that time we were just good friends. So probably 2001.

SPEAKER_02 36:35

Okay. Is when we 24 years ago, 25 years ago.

SPEAKER_01 36:39

25 years next year. Jesus.

SPEAKER_02 36:41

And you got three, you've got three kids?

SPEAKER_01 36:43

Yes, I do. I got three kids. One's about to be 14, one just turned 12, and uh my daughter is nine and a half, going on 36. We all have one of those.

SPEAKER_04 36:58

And and the more kids you have, the more draw. There's always drama. Somebody there, it's always gonna be drama.

SPEAKER_01 37:03

Without the without all the information, no more kids will be happening.

SPEAKER_04 37:06

So something happened, but we're not gonna talk about it.

SPEAKER_01 37:09

You know. Just put it this way: there were frozen peas involved, and does that work?

SPEAKER_04 37:15

Like the frozen pea thing. I've always, you know, like it it works. It helps, it helps, doesn't it? It helps. Not that I'll have your after experience.

SPEAKER_01 37:23

I'll give you an amazing uh story in 20 seconds. When I went to go have the procedure done, it's fantastic because nowadays, for all the men out there, uh I suggest you be responsible. Don't put it on your wife to tie the tubes or whatever. So I went, it's a laser thing, it's done in 10 minutes. Cool, no problem. So, what do you think is the biggest thing that people are afraid of when they have these procedures? What do you think the biggest thing is?

SPEAKER_04 37:47

Um, there's two things that immediately came to mind.

SPEAKER_01 37:49

Yep.

SPEAKER_04 37:50

One is um, can they have an erection after over it's right away? And the other one is can they pee?

SPEAKER_01 37:55

So nothing to do with that, 10 times more embarrassing.

SPEAKER_03 38:00

What? I can't even imagine.

SPEAKER_01 38:01

So I'm there and from the waist down, I'm naked, but it's just me and the doctor. The doctor says, hey, listen, I'll be back in like five minutes. I'm like, cool, whatever. So I'm laying there on the table, naked from the waist down. Nurse comes in and says, Do you remember me? I was like, oh my God. I said, uh no. She's like, Yeah, we were in, we were in your friend Troy's wedding party together. I was like, oh, good to see you.

SPEAKER_04 38:36

I thought you were gonna say you dated, which would have might have been even worse.

SPEAKER_01 38:39

Oh, that would have been fine. That would have been funny. But that's just one of but that's just one of those ones it's like, you know, for a man, like it's you're there vulnerable, you're half, you're just there just with your business out and somebody cut, and you know, it's professional, but at the same time, it's like, remember we were in that wedding together the other day.

SPEAKER_04 38:56

I was like, oh you know, I'm trying to gather up some, you know, some sense of, you know, you know, feeling for you. But as a woman who has visited many gynecologists, we have you know, you have nothing on us, okay? You have nothing on what we do.

SPEAKER_03 39:10

But has that ever happened to where a man walked in and was like, I I Oh my gosh.

SPEAKER_04 39:37

So anyhow, you're you're a complete joy to talk to you. You are you are a force.

SPEAKER_01 39:43

I'm a maniac, is what I am.

SPEAKER_04 39:44

No, I I I a hundred percent every minute of our conversation. You are you're you're just like you're so open and you shared so much, and I really, really, really appreciate you.

SPEAKER_01 39:57

I may have shared too much.

SPEAKER_04 39:58

No, you didn't.

SPEAKER_03 40:02

Maybe. I mean, we all had an MA television, not gonna lie.

SPEAKER_01 40:08

Oh my gosh, that's so funny.

SPEAKER_03 40:10

Anyway, wherever you are on your journey, anything you want to say to you know the audience before you, you know, here?

SPEAKER_01 40:16

Uh hold on. I think this is my good side. Um anything that I would like to say, I would I would really love to say, listen, guys, the world is in an odd place. It's in an odd place. And there's so much information that we are privy to. Um, but I think with AI, I think with social media, with everybody saying all the things all the time, we're not taking the care that we used to take to get to know one another, to sit down and have conversations and understand. Because I think the reason that we were able to progress so much as a society together was because we were aware of what one another was doing and we took the time to learn, to understand, acknowledge, and improve. And what I would really, really, really suggest for everybody that's watching Miss Arlene, this episode, and every other episode is to take something, think about it, and figure out how you're going to integrate that into what it is that you do. Because I think every episode there's something incredibly valuable that can make your life better. And hopefully there were one or two things that you learned or that you were um that you discovered uh that can help you on your life's journey.

SPEAKER_04 41:39

I mean, I don't know how to add to that. Um wherever you are in your in your journey, I hope that this conversation has helped you, and and I hope you take Cardinal Jason's um words to heart and um listen to the conversations. We love having them. We love having you included in them, and we hope you feel like you were sitting on a chair right beside us. So good luck on your journey, and we'll see you next time on Arlenas Alone.

SPEAKER_01 42:00

That's right.